Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 14 Jun 2017 10:20

Shakespeare wrote:
14 Jun 2017 10:16
there is nothing about a mall that makes people want to go and spend time there
The summer scenery can be interesting for us DOM. :wink:
Depends on where you are at. Our mall is dead in summer. The lake beaches are a much better proposition. :P
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 15 Jun 2017 12:51

Hindsight is always valuable. I've never owned any of these stocks, but I've come to appreciate the value of innovation, risk and competitive advantages. If you looked at the service model they had 15 years ago you couldn't have guessed their business model would be this flawed without a strong enduring internet presence. Today that's obvious, but it was also obvious 2-3 years ago when it was sold, bought, resold, bought again.
Someone should simply sell off the most valuable pieces and let it die.
In a perfect move they would simply sell the Kenmore brand on Amazon and allow people to purchase a good quality appliance online, with free shipping and make a much more competitive offer in comparison to what Lowes, HD and other appliance chains offer. Costco has already been doing this successfully for a few years but hasn't really leveraged it as well as I might have expected them to.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by FinEcon » 15 Jun 2017 15:55

brad911 wrote:
15 Jun 2017 12:51
Hindsight is always valuable. I've never owned any of these stocks, but I've come to appreciate the value of innovation, risk and competitive advantages. If you looked at the service model they had 15 years ago you couldn't have guessed their business model would be this flawed without a strong enduring internet presence. Today that's obvious, but it was also obvious 2-3 years ago when it was sold, bought, resold, bought again.
Someone should simply sell off the most valuable pieces and let it die.
In a perfect move they would simply sell the Kenmore brand on Amazon and allow people to purchase a good quality appliance online, with free shipping and make a much more competitive offer in comparison to what Lowes, HD and other appliance chains offer. Costco has already been doing this successfully for a few years but hasn't really leveraged it as well as I might have expected them to.
What do you think Lampert has been doing for years.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Shakespeare » 21 Jun 2017 09:00

“A wise man should be prepared to abandon his baggage at any time.” -- R.A. Heinlein, The Door Into Summer.

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 21 Jun 2017 10:31

Can't happen soon enough. Like the poor sod that has battled cancer for a decade, it must have been a tough way being an employee of such an inept outfit.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Shakespeare » 22 Jun 2017 11:52

Sears Canada to close 59 stores, cut 2,900 jobs - The Globe and Mail
Stores slated to be closed are:

Sears Full-Line: Medicine Hat, AB ; Grande Prairie, AB ; Lloydminster, AB ; Red Deer Relocation, AB ;Kamloops Aberdeen Mall, BC ;Bathurst, NB ;Saint John, NB ;Corner Brook, NL ;Truro Mall, NS ;Dartmouth, NS ;Brockville, ON ;Sault Ste. Marie, ON ;Hull, QC ;Chicoutimi, QC ;St. Georges de Beauce, QC ; Alma, QC ;Drummondville, QC ;Regina, SK ;Moose Jaw, SK;Prince Albert, SK

Hometown: Cold Lake, AB ;St. Albert, AB ;Okotoks, AB ;Spruce Grove, AB ;Ft. McMurray, AB ;Leduc, AB ;Sherwood Park, AB ;Creston, BC ;Sechelt, BC ;Grand Forks, BC ;Orangeville, ON ;Rimouski, QC ;Rouyn-Noranda, QC ;Melville, SK

Outlet: Abbotsford Retail, BC ;Winnipeg Garden City, MB ;Halifax Outlet, NS ;Cornwall, ON ;Chatham, ON ;Cambridge, ON ;Timmins, ON ;St. Eustache, QC ;Montreal Place Vertu, QC ;Sorel, QC

Sears Home: Calgary, AB ;Edmonton Skyview, AB ;Ancaster, ON ;Woodbridge, ON ;London, ON ;Scarborough, ON ;Kingston, ON ;Ottawa East, ON ;Sudbury, ON ;Windsor, ON ;Orillia, ON ;St. Bruno, QC ;Laval, QC ;Quebec City, QC ;Ste. Foy, QC
Interesting that the Hat store closes but the Lethbridge one doesn't.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 22 Jun 2017 12:23

Lethbridge has way more population to support it. When you go through the list, it is predominately smaller centres and many of the Sears Home stores (so that format is hooped too).

Kelowna doesn't lose either the Orchard Park mall store, nor the Sears Home store at the same mall....yet. Then again, the Okanagan is growing rapidly.....so they maybe holding out hope the stores will rebound from empty bowling alleys.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 13 Oct 2017 15:07

The last spike has been delivered on this long drawn out death http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/sears-c ... -1.4353011
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 13 Oct 2017 15:14

:thumbsup:
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by 2 yen » 13 Oct 2017 15:41

AltaRed wrote:
13 Oct 2017 15:07
The last spike has been delivered on this long drawn out death http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/sears-c ... -1.4353011
Innovate or die.

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 13 Oct 2017 19:12

Innovate or (in their case) struggle, become a black hole of capital, restructure multiple times, make an even bigger black hole and then finally, after consuming everything it possibly can.....die.

Buffett would not have endorsed this allocation of capital!
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by 2 yen » 13 Oct 2017 19:21

brad911 wrote:
13 Oct 2017 19:12
Innovate or (in their case) struggle, become a black hole of capital, restructure multiple times, make an even bigger black hole and then finally, after consuming everything it possibly can.....die.

Buffett would not have endorsed this allocation of capital!
Plus, start treating your customers like dirt - not honoring warranties, outsourcing repairs to mickey mouse companies, charging for delivery by outsourced yahoos, not maintaining stores, not even cleaning stores properly, badly designed displays with run-of-the mill merchandise, lack of floor staff, terrible phone center service, useless website. Will not miss Sears one bit.

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by beachcomber » 13 Oct 2017 19:37

Sears Canada lost its edge several decades ago. 50 years ago their Kenmore appliances and their Craftsman tools were cherished by our family. Adapt or perish :(

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 13 Oct 2017 20:11

I think these will be interesting case studies for business schools moving forward.
You could argue that for years (or decades) companies like Sears, The Bay & others had competitive business models and did do certain things well.
Their direct mail business (before the internet) had to have been successful they just never thought to be proactive, evolve and ended up having to adapt. Better to be proactive then reactive!
These events make me look at my portfolio and ask if any of my holdings (or watchlist stocks) have their business models in the same situation.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 13 Oct 2017 20:45

Many companies that have a successful business model get way too comfortable in their own skins and don't see the trains coming down the tracks. They get addicted to their revenue streams, i.e. if its material to their bottom lines, they will protect it rather than evolve with the times. There are numerous other examples that went through rough times but scrambled to succeed. IBM is a good example.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Shakespeare » 13 Oct 2017 21:26

Ironic to go from catalogue shopping back to catalogue shopping - and those that started it (Sears and Eatons) messed up the transition back.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 13 Oct 2017 21:27

If you're not growing you're dying.....
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Profit not Prophet » 14 Oct 2017 07:25

So where do you go to buy a shirt now that's better than Walmart and less pricey than say Columbia? The classic middle age middle income beige Canadian seems to have fewer choices when it comes to clothing with a good quality/price balance. There's lots of noise and flashing signs but not so much in reality me thinks.

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by brad911 » 14 Oct 2017 10:03

That is an interesting question: where does the Sears consumer demographic now go for purchases? It may be a smaller population (niche?) but still has value.
Does HBC actually innovate and adapt to consolidate and serve? I doubt they have the interest, capacity or $$ to pursue it.
Does CTC (Mark's) aggressively target this demographic for clothing (not the same style)
Online will get a boost, but that is assuming customer base wants to buy online (some people still like tactile experiences).

The overall move towards online and out of store purchases will continue, but there is still value in the Sears customer base for the time being. A company that can attract, retain and grow that customer base while continuing to innovate could be an attractive investment. But retail in NA is either moving forward fast or dying....I don't really see a middle ground being established.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Peculiar_Investor » 14 Oct 2017 10:30

For many items I've always felt there was significant overlap between Sears and The Bay and not much to distinguish between the two. In many urban centres they were both part of the same mall complex, so comparison and price shopping was very easy. I cannot imagine that was very helpful to either's bottom line.

The bigger issue for me was the fact that Sears Canada was controlled from the US and as the US company struggled, they've seemingly totally neglected Sears Canada.

From an investment perspective, there are very few listed Canadian subsidiaries that have given me any reason to consider becoming a shareholder. More often than not, the US parent's interests are not aligned with their Canadian shareholders, making them a poor investment IMHO.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by 2 yen » 14 Oct 2017 10:50

A friend just went to Home Depot to buy a dishwasher. They said it would take 4 weeks. She then drove to Ikea, paid $389 for a basic dishwasher and drove home with it. 4 weeks is nonsense. That's the kind of inventory mismanagement that is killing old style shops. Regarding the Sears demographic - the Bay is probably the closest to what they are used to. But I fear for at least some of the Bay stores - they have many of the same problems as Sears had. Honestly, I've been in much better department stores in 2nd world countries than either Sears or the Bay. Our local bay is filthy (dirty floors, stained carpets, rusty escalator, dust bunnies everywhere). They should be ashamed of themselves. Going there is a real punishment to be avoided if possible.

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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by AltaRed » 14 Oct 2017 11:56

I agree with P_I the Bay carries much of the same 'fashion' stuff the 'average' consumer would have bought from Sears. The Bay will benefit quite a bit from that. Example: That $40 Arrow dress shirt is still at The Bay. The Bay does not have to make a single change to capture that demographic.

The change is in where does the age 70-95 demographic that frequented Sears go? Marks to some degree, Joe Fresh, WalMart, Reitmans, TipTop and other similar 'old folks' places that are ingrained into 'old folks' memories for that last 3 decades. But be practical. How many clothes (and other goods) does the age 70-95 demographic buy? And at what price point? My mother in her later years got all her stuff from the local WalMart Supercentre and the Co-op department store in her home town. My consumption is near zero. I replace what wears out or breaks.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by Shakespeare » 14 Oct 2017 12:34

I don't buy the $40 Arrow dress shirt; suits are for weddings, baptisms, and funerals now. WalMart carries some not-bad sport shirts if you avoid the George crap.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by pmj » 14 Oct 2017 12:51

Historically I bought most of my shirts at the Bay. It used to be one of the few places one could reliably find fitted shirts. Now I mostly buy them at the Bay online. V aggressive pricing, easy to get free delivery.
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Re: Sears Canada (Symbol-SCC)

Post by IdOp » 14 Oct 2017 18:45

I used to buy some shirts and the like at Sears. That was before the most recent makeover, after which I found it fairly useless. I agree the Bay is similar, but it was always more pricey, even when on sale, so I tended to buy very little there. With Sears gone, it won't encourage the Bay to lower their prices. I guess it will be Wal-Mart for me more now.

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