Tax Instalments

Income tax policy, rules, problems, strategy and software. Property and consumption taxes too.
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Shakespeare
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Tax Instalments

Post by Shakespeare »

Ante up, folks. Today's the day. :(

Edited to correct spelling.
Last edited by Shakespeare on 17 Mar 2005 20:32, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by par4 »

Thanks Shakes, :) I would have forgotten!
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Post by St. Thomas Bill »

Sent mine by Canada Post yesterday. Does post mark count?
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Shakespeare
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Post by Shakespeare »

Does post mark count?
I believe so. I hope my 'e-post' mark counts, too; I forgot to do the e-transfer yesterday.
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Bylo Selhi
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Post by Bylo Selhi »

I had post-dated transactions at ING to transfer money to TD/CT on the 11th and for TD/CT to pay CRA on the 15th.

Unfortunately, ING won't let me do a post-dated transaction as far into the future as June, so I'll have to remember to set this up again in May.
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Post by Shakespeare »

[OT]I use my Scotia high-income savings - 2.0% - for temporary parking of a few $K, rather than transferring the money to ING at 2.4%. The interest rate differential is about $20/year for a $5K balance (before tax) and the money is instantly transferable from one Scotia account to the other with no holds or delays.[/OT]
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Post by bardel »

Bylo,

I set up to transfer the installment amount from ING to TD on March 15th and also set up the payment from my TD account the same day on March 15th. I have been doing this for a few years and have never had a problem yet with all of my transfers from ING and payments from TD.

Why do you do the transfer from ING to TD 4 days in advance?
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Post by Westford »

What is the tax installment day? Is this different from the normal tax return one files before/by April 30?
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Shakespeare
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Post by Shakespeare »

If you owed more than $2K on a previous year's taxes, CCRA may want instalments in the next year. These are due March 15, June 15, September 15, and December 15.

If you don't expect to owe $2K in the current year, you can ignore the instalment request - but may be charged late penalties if you are wrong.
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Post by Bylo Selhi »

bardel wrote:Why do you do the transfer from ING to TD 4 days in advance?
It was the first time I did this (post-date a transfer out of ING.)

Their Move My Money page offers these options:
1. Now: Initiate transfer today
2. Later: [fill in date]
3. Ongoing: [specify details]
Since option 1. says "initiate" it wasn't clear to me if 2. Later meant date of initiation or date of actual transfer. It wasn't worth the cost of NSF charges to find out ;) Now that I know I'll use the 15th.

BTW, one nice characteristic of TD's post-date feature is that it won't let you do a transaction on a non-business day. Instead it automatically sets the date to the next business day. One bad characteristic of this feature is that they don't warn you. If you're not careful some greedy credit card company could nail you with interest charges.
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Post by brucecohen »

I too move money from my ING tax reserve account to TD a few days early just to play safe. And, for the same reason, I told TD's system to pay CRA last Friday, March 11. With interest rates so low, there's virtually no opportunity cost to playing it safe. A slip-up beyond my control once put me onto CRA's interest treadmill. I definitely don't want to go there again.

My installment notice contained a form for automatic preauthorized payment. Normally I go for that, but this time I passed. Might be irrational, but I feel more comfortable knowing that I've moved sufficient funds and ordered the payment. Did anyone else get the form, and did you sign up?
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Post by Westford »

Shakespeare wrote:If you owed more than $2K on a previous year's taxes, CCRA may want instalments in the next year. These are due March 15, June 15, September 15, and December 15.

If you don't expect to owe $2K in the current year, you can ignore the instalment request - but may be charged late penalties if you are wrong.
Thanks, Shakes. I got a refund last year (education cost credit), so I guess that means I am ok. I expect a refund this year as well (RRSP contributions). God knows, they take it off the top enough as it is. I have not set up anything with Human Resources yet so that they take less off my paychecks, but will probably do so this summer. I realize that I am losing out on the interest. :?
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Post by adrian2 »

bardel wrote:Bylo,

I set up to transfer the installment amount from ING to TD on March 15th and also set up the payment from my TD account the same day on March 15th. I have been doing this for a few years and have never had a problem yet with all of my transfers from ING and payments from TD.

Why do you do the transfer from ING to TD 4 days in advance?
ING does not guarantee you'll get the funds on the same day. So far, with CIBC at the other end, it did work.

OTOH, if you're pushing this to the limit (same day for both transactions) make sure the amount you're paying does not exceed your current pre-ING transfer balance, plus any overdraft protection. CIBC asks that you have the money for a bill payment available in your account on the previous business day. I'm assuming they have to decide whether to let the transaction through on the morning it's (post-)dated.
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Post by Shakespeare »

I would do the ING transfer the previous day.
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Post by bardel »

It sounds like the transfers should be done the previous day of the bill payment due date to play it safe.

I know what Bylo is talking about with regards to a greedy credit card company (CIBC Aeroplan). A year ago or so they changed their policy from payment due "on" to payment due "by" which meant they wanted their money the day before the date indicated. They caught me one month and charged me interest. A phone call reversed the charges and I always pay their entire balance the day before the date indicated. I have requested the CIBC VISA automatic payment authorizations forms (after waiting on hold on the phone for half an hour for a live body) (see other thread) so I will not have to worry about paying their bill if I am on holidays. I will just have to ensure that there is enough money in the account to pay it when it is due (via post-dated transfer from ING). Hopefully it will work real slick when it is set up.

Bruce Cohen
I did get the forms from CRA for an automatic preauthorized payment but will not be taking advantage of the feature. My income varies from year to year and I want the ability to pay less than what they are asking for quarterly (especially Dec 15) if I know my tax liability for the current year will be reduced from their installment calculations.
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Tax clarification

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Shakespeare wrote:If you owed more than $2K on a previous year's taxes, CCRA may want instalments in the next year. These are due March 15, June 15, September 15, and December 15.
Because of changes in my financial situation, I paid more than $2k last year. Would CCRA have notified me...or did I miss something???
I'm starting to work on 2004 return and will again have to pay more than $2k........so want to watch for clues that I am completing my tax return correctly.
Thanks
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Post by Shakespeare »

You should have got a reminder from CRA if you needed to pay installments, giving the amounts due. See CRA Installments
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Post by infopls »

Thanks, Shakes.....appears that they will 'find' me this year!
I will watch for your date reminders!!...........
Thanks for the link.......
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Post by cardhu »

I've been on quarterly installments for about 8 years. One year, I didn't get my winter reminder notice, so I called them about it. They confirmed that none was sent, and told me that since they didn't send a notice, I was not obliged to make any installment payments for those quarters. Of course, that just meant that my Q3 & Q4 installments were twice the norm. Point is, the obligation only begins when they start sending you the notices.
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Post by dakota »

I just got my income tax forms back from the accountant and for the first time have to pay instalments but the first one is not due until Sept. I would have assumed that the first one would be due in June? I phoned the company and they said it was based on '03, still don't understand their reasoning but we'll see what CRA has to say. :?
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Post by Bylo Selhi »

dakota wrote:the first one is not due until Sept. I would have assumed that the first one would be due in June?
You don't have to pay until CRA tells you you have to pay, i.e. they won't charge you any interest or penalties if you pay when and how much they ask.
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Post by AltaRed »

Can verify that Bylo has it right. Only have to pay installments when CRA asks you to. I've been in and out of the installment system for years mostly as a result of me being taxable in Canada (or not as an ex-pat). And the first 2 installments of the year (e.g. 2005) are based on 2003 taxes.
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Post by dakota »

And the first 2 installments of the year (e.g. 2005) are based on 2003 taxes.

The accountant said something to that effect, maybe he is earning his money after all. :)
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Post by Bylo Selhi »

Reminder: The next instalment is due on Wed15Jun05.
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Post by dakota »

Bylo Selhi wrote:Reminder: The next instalment is due on Wed15Jun05.
Not mine hopefully! :?
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